Topic: Israel/Palestine conflict

Offline Pyromanik

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Quote from: Arnifix;1509288
Does anyone else see the video? I see the code when quoting your post bell, but can't see the video at all. :(

Ensure flash is installed, and javascript is enabled.
I never see vid embeds because I don't flash. Not even a placeholder comes up, which is probably to do with JS detection or something.
Last Edit: November 19, 2012, 08:30:09 pm by Pyromanik

Reply #50 Posted: November 19, 2012, 08:26:59 pm
Everyone needs more Bruce Campbell.

Offline Bell

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Heres what the one of the founders of Israel and the first Prime minster had to say over 70 years ago, you won't hear the current leaders say this sort of stuff.
Strange what 70 years of PR does to an argument.

Quote
In our political argument abroad, we minimize Arab opposition to us. But let us not ignore the truth among ourselves. I insist on the truth, not out of respect for scientific but political realities. The acknowledgement of this truth leads to inevitable and serious conclusions regarding our work in Palestine… let us not build on the hope the terrorist gangs will get tired. If some get tired, others will replace them.
A people which fights against the usurpation of its land will not tire so easily... it is easier for them to continue the war and not get tired than it is for us... The Palestinian Arabs are not alone. The Syrians are coming to help. From our point of view, they are strangers; in the point of law they are foreigners; but to the Arabs, they are not foreigners at all ... The centre of the war is in Palestine, but its dimensions are much wider. When we say that the Arabs are the aggressors and we defend ourselves — this is only half the truth. As regards our security and life we defend ourselves and our moral and physical position is not bad. We can face the gangs... and were we allowed to mobilize all our forces we would have no doubts about the outcome... But the fighting is only one aspect of the conflict which is in its essence a political one. And politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves. Militarily, it is we who are on the defensive who have the upper hand but in the political sphere they are superior. The land, the villages, the mountains, the roads are in their hands. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country, while we are still outside. They defend bases which are theirs, which is easier than conquering new bases... let us not think that the terror is a result of Hitler's or Mussolini's propaganda — this helps but the source of opposition is there among the Arabs.
David Ben-Gurion - Address at the Mapai Political Committee (7 June 1938)
Last Edit: November 19, 2012, 09:21:38 pm by Bell

Reply #51 Posted: November 19, 2012, 09:19:21 pm

Offline Aloysius

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And being elected to office?

Reply #52 Posted: November 20, 2012, 12:22:39 am

Offline Arnifix

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Quote from: winter;1509311
This shit is scary man, seeing all of these dead kids really hits home when you actually have a child..

I'm not well informed on the current Israel/Palestine situation apart from what I'm seeing on the News and what have you, which so far has been PALESTINE BAD, ISRAEL GOOD and vice versa,
Is there a distinctive 'bad' guy in this situation? one channel is playing up Israel civilians being hit by rockets and the next minute it's the opposite?

What's the gist? or could I chime back to 5th form Social studies, Israel vs Palestine and add 40 years onto the dates?

also, for extra points, isn't Hamas a terrorist organization (again, to the extent of my knowledge, extreme baby brain still) so their leader being assassinated would be a 'good' thing? yes?

I'm so confused :(
Israel as a state has existed for less than 70 years. The British (through the League of Nations iirc) wanted to create a homeland for the Jewish peoples. So in classic empire building style, they split Palestine in half and gave half it to the Zionist occupying forces. The local Arabs were initially bought out but some refused to leave and the settlers took up arms to drive them out. They realized that was rather a lot cheaper than paying, so that became the norm.

The arabs weren't so keen and several very famous wars were fought to try and stop the Zionist movement, with Israel kicking seven kinds of shit out of the military forces of every country that surrounds them. These defeats lost still more ground, and gave the Israelis a good excuse to police the Arabs brutally.

There have been several attempted ethnic cleansings of the Arabs by the Jews and vast quantities of blood spilled, the vast majority being Palestinian. There is a list of warcrimes committed by Israel during the violence which I believes numbers to 65ish.

Don't get me wrong, the Arab forces have done some very bad shit, but let's put this in perspective. 3 Israelis are dead and I think the Palestinian death toll is somewhere around 100 with another 900 injured. The media keeps saying half of them were civilians. The other half were Palestinian security forces, not necessarily militants, more like cops. The Israelis are killing cops, then when firefighters and ambulance crews turn up to do their jobs, bombing them too!

There is a lot of very good stuff online about this, Democracy Now has some great videos. You should read about it but it's fucking grim.

Oh also, the guy that Israeli killed that "started" this whole thing, he'd just ratified a more permanent ceasefire than the one that was in place. But that isn't in Israels interest.

Reply #53 Posted: November 20, 2012, 07:23:12 pm

Let us retract the foreskin of ignorance and apply the wirebrush of enlightenment.

Offline mycoolcar

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This is worth watching. Its a bit wordy and stuff, but interesting.



Reply #54 Posted: November 20, 2012, 07:37:12 pm

Offline Bell

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Reply #55 Posted: November 20, 2012, 08:33:37 pm

Offline kookynic

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Quote from: mycoolcar;1509429
This is worth watching. Its a bit wordy and stuff, but interesting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wb6IiSUxpgw


So its a clusterfuck either way, with Israel there is a fight between Palestine and Israel, Without Israel its a 3way middle eastern war.

Reply #56 Posted: November 20, 2012, 09:40:02 pm

Offline winter

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What an almost impossible situation to resolve.. both peoples won't want to leave 'their' land to resolve this so I really don't see how long this 'ceasefire' can realistically last?

I propose this resolution, how about nobody lives in Israel and Palestinians get it for one weekend, and then Jewish peoples get it the next. They live in/around the border and Israel can be
turned into a massive tourist location for all those religiousy types and everyone can be lovely and stop firing rockets at one another, it's not nice.

Problem solved.

Reply #57 Posted: November 21, 2012, 09:50:37 am

Offline LeadCollector

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This solution Hijacked from another thread :)

Reply #58 Posted: November 21, 2012, 11:31:21 am

Quote from: Spork;1411842
Your face won\'t make top four!

Offline [Paranoid]^

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I know it's just Huffpo but I thought this wasn't too badly written;

5 Lies the Media Keeps Repeating About Gaza
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/omar-baddar/5-lies-the-media-keeps-re_b_2160239.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false

Reply #59 Posted: November 21, 2012, 09:05:28 pm

Offline Bell

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Reply #60 Posted: November 22, 2012, 03:46:30 am

Offline SteddieEddie

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Reply #61 Posted: November 22, 2012, 08:09:05 am

Offline Arnifix

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Quote from: '[Paranoid
^;1509561']I know it's just Huffpo but I thought this wasn't too badly written;

5 Lies the Media Keeps Repeating About Gaza
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/omar-baddar/5-lies-the-media-keeps-re_b_2160239.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false
The comments make me sad.

Reply #62 Posted: November 23, 2012, 07:38:05 am

Let us retract the foreskin of ignorance and apply the wirebrush of enlightenment.

Offline mycoolcar

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Pic bell posted looks like a scene from BF3.

Reply #63 Posted: November 23, 2012, 04:42:31 pm

Offline Threadcollector

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Quote from: mycoolcar;1509808
Pic bell posted looks like a scene from BF3.

 
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/589/mavriderplo.png
Israel/Palestine conflict

Reply #64 Posted: November 24, 2012, 01:30:19 am

There\'s a new sheriff in town

Offline Xsannz

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Hmmmm. Who's alt account is thread collector......

Reply #65 Posted: November 24, 2012, 08:27:57 am

Offline Bell

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[video=vimeo;15843191]http://vimeo.com/15843191[/video]

Reply #66 Posted: November 26, 2012, 05:06:35 am

Offline Bell

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Reply #67 Posted: December 01, 2012, 10:08:54 pm

Offline Tiwaking!

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Quote from: Bell;1509945
[video=vimeo;15843191]http://vimeo.com/15843191[/video]

Adeeb is right. The fence will fall

Reply #68 Posted: December 02, 2012, 04:29:08 pm
I am now banned from GetSome

Offline Bell

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Reply #69 Posted: January 11, 2013, 10:07:34 pm